Why IT Needs Deep Visibility for Application Rollouts

In Episode 183 of The Citrix Session, host Bill Sutton is joined by Citrix experts Geremy Meyers and Todd Smith to break down how IT leaders can make smarter decisions when rolling out Windows 365. They explore the growing importance of deep visibility, flexible deployment models, and persona-based strategies to support modern hybrid environments. This discussion highlights how Citrix technology enhances Windows 365 with features like HDX optimization, unified access through Workspace, and policy-based control—all while simplifying complex enterprise needs.

What you’ll learn:

• Why a “one-size-fits-all” approach doesn’t work for Windows 365 rollouts
• How Citrix enables seamless access to Windows 365, SaaS, on-prem, and cloud apps
• The role of user personas in right-sizing application delivery
• Where Tech Zone fits into your strategy for technical insights and deployment guides
• How Citrix licenses support unlimited Windows 365 connections

👉 Don’t miss this deep dive into how Citrix helps you modernize IT without compromise.

Transcript

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Bill Sutton: Hello, everyone, and welcome to episode 182 of the Citrix session. I'm your host for today, Bill Sutton. I have with me a couple of folks from Citrix, Jeremy Myers and Todd Smith. Jeremy, you wanna it's been a while since you've been with us. You wanna

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Bill Sutton: just introduce yourself to the crowd.

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Geremy Meyers: Sure, Bill. I'm Jeremy Myers long time caller long time listener.

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Bill Sutton: But.

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Geremy Meyers: On a few times. I've been on a few of these.

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Geremy Meyers: That's good to see you. I've been out for a a little bit actually did a little vacation, Todd. I was up in your neck of the woods. Went to Boston last week, so we had a good time.

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Todd Smith: Were you at the Coldplay Concert.

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Geremy Meyers: I was at the Coldplay concert. I did get to witness

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Geremy Meyers: firsthand the incident. We won't go into it, but we'll just call it the incident this point. If you don't know what we're talking about.

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Geremy Meyers: then clearly, you have not been on the Internet. But yeah, yeah, I could see that firsthand.

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Todd Smith: Nice.

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Geremy Meyers: It was it was. There was a there was a chuckle for sure, because

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Geremy Meyers: it was more of a Hey! That can't. It would be funny if that was true, and it turned out it was.

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Bill Sutton: Yeah. Interesting. Todd, you want to say, Hello.

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Todd Smith: Sure. So hey, guys, my name is Todd Smith.

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Todd Smith: glad to be joining us joining you guys all today.

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Todd Smith: Bill, we're getting closer and closer to episode 200.

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Bill Sutton: We are. I you know. I think I mentioned to you last week. I don't know that we're gonna make it. But if we don't make it by the end of 25. It'll be very early in 26 when we hit it. When we hit it.

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Geremy Meyers: Across it. Yep.

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Bill Sutton: Yeah, but we will get there. I know we will, and we may get there quicker than I think, because we found some more area, another area for content, which I will talk about briefly here. So historically for our listeners, we've gosh! We've sorry about that. We've always focused on the citrix blog site, which is citrix.com slash blogs. And that's, I think, wouldn't you guys say, kind of more

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Bill Sutton: marketing, not really marketing. But mark somewhat technical, but really more focused on architecture, probably, than anything.

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Geremy Meyers: You know what that's probably pretty fair also fair would be. Listen, it's blogs.citrix.com. I think this has been our jumping off point.

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Geremy Meyers: That's right, for long

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Geremy Meyers: time, right? And it's been interesting to see the blog site sort of change over the years. But I think

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Geremy Meyers: we have, you know, uncovered is not the right word, because the tech zone.

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Bill Sutton: Yeah.

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Geremy Meyers: Has been here for a while like we've had text on for years. I don't know that we

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Geremy Meyers: I don't know that we socialize the tech zone blogs. But listen, there's a lot of good content here. In fact, you know, I think we've consolidated a few things into. It's just community.citrix.com and tech zone has been one of those areas. And it's got a specific blog, you know, Link as well that's worth looking into. So

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Geremy Meyers: maybe where we're trying to go with this conversation is we're going to expand our blog resources to potentially the blogs that Citrix main site as well as the text. Zone blogs.

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Bill Sutton: Yeah, which?

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Geremy Meyers: Tend to be a little bit meatier, right? So a little bit more technical focused how to in certain cases with certain articles. But

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Geremy Meyers: there's some good stuff we'll we'll cover today.

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Bill Sutton: Yep. And to that end what we're going to cover today is a tech zone blog entitled Optimizing Windows, 3, 65 investments, simplifying flexibility for enterprise. Success.

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Bill Sutton: This is by Thomas.

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Bill Sutton: Is it Burger, or is it Berger?

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Geremy Meyers: It's it's Burger. It's Burger. Yeah, he's it's 1 of the one of the Ogs man. He's been around for a while.

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Bill Sutton: Yeah, he has. I met him at a I think he taught a 1 of those labs hands on labs or something years ago at a synergy, and I haven't been so. I have met him, but he wouldn't know me from Adam. But nevertheless.

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Bill Sutton: so this this blog article, really is reflecting on some of the benefits. And I'm I'm paraphrasing here. Obviously, we'll go into a lot more detail of of leveraging your citrix entitlements for windows, 3, 65, providing choice

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Bill Sutton: and, you know, enabling enabling customers to really have a mix to mix and match whether they're dealing with published applications, or a or a cloud? PC. Or shared desktops, or what have you so? This. This goes into a little bit of detail on some of the thought process you may want to go through when you're you're determining which way you want to which direction you want to go. So Jeremy, you wanna give kind of a general overview here of this.

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Geremy Meyers: Yeah, yeah, I mean, listen, I think we've covered windows 365 as a technology in some previous some previous podcasts. We've done. But you know, I think the focus of this one's a little bit different in that. It really kind of gets into the nuts of exactly. How do you leverage this right like, why is it flexible? How is it flexible? You know.

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Geremy Meyers: you know, from an enterprise perspective, just thinking through how enterprise it deploys technology. It works a little bit different than what we see on a marketing slide. Right? So most customers don't go from. This is how I'm doing it today to cut over date, I'm doing something entirely different. Right? So in this case. So just to give you an example.

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Geremy Meyers: because I got several customers who are exploring how to leverage windows. 365 and a marketing slide might tell you. Oh, by the way, you can go from, I'm doing it this way with Citrix, even, you know, just on Prem. Apps on prem desktops, you know, managing it with on Prem Citrix to

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Geremy Meyers: you know I've got a cut over date in 2 months, where everything is going, every desktop, every user will be using windows, 365 desktop. And that's just not how it works. Right? You know. So 2 things. One, it's tends to be very, we're gonna move a user group over. We're gonna move this over. We're gonna do some very strategic tactical moves. And in a lot of cases you've got a very distributed sort of environment. And the idea is, honestly, this is where Citrix shines. The idea that

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Geremy Meyers: you know to help manage sort of a move like that, you know. How do you do it? To where it becomes transparent to the end user. So

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Geremy Meyers: that's probably this in a nutshell. So we're gonna talk through some of those different things to consider. So some of the different deployment models.

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Geremy Meyers: because there's not a 1 size fits all approach when you look at any technology. And I think that's what we're kind of get to here with windows? 3, 65, you know. How do you make it flexible in a in an enterprise deployment.

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Bill Sutton: Yeah. And I think one of the takeaways here of this article. I don't want to jump to the end here. But

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Bill Sutton: is that to your point. You don't really. This isn't really about how to go. One all in with Win 365. It's about, how do you use the tools you have

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Bill Sutton: to satisfy, to address the personas, or use cases that are appropriate for your business, and assessing that and and and

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Bill Sutton: putting forth, putting forth your design of how you're gonna get to that is an important part of

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Bill Sutton: of the process. Obviously, Todd, any thoughts here.

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Todd Smith: Yeah, I think there's been a challenge for the past several years when we've talked about flexibility and agility

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Todd Smith: and merge that in with the fact that we've got basically one license, that kind of covers all of the different use cases.

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Todd Smith: We haven't been really prescriptive about how to use those

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Todd Smith: that single license to be able to go and satisfy all these different use cases easily. Right? So

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Todd Smith: Oftentimes we got pulled into conversations. Where, hey? If we just want a virtual desktop, we can use some feature.

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Todd Smith: And it it oftentimes creates a little bit of confusion within the customer base that that it isn't just a single purpose built solution that you have to buy specific for that.

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Todd Smith: It's kind of

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Todd Smith: hey? We can use this license to do a published application. We can do a virtualized application. We can do. A virtualized desktop.

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Todd Smith: you know, shared hosted desktop. A variety of different things. The delivery mechanism can be anything you want.

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Todd Smith: But you're leveraging that same license. Right? It's a it's an agility and flexibility concern that a lot of organizations get kind of caught up in.

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Todd Smith: And you almost need to go through a systematic review of what are we trying to do?

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Todd Smith: What are the constraints that we have, and what are the different options we have to deliver

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Todd Smith: based on those requirements.

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Bill Sutton: Yeah, absolutely. So. In the middle of this article there's a there's a little graphic that shows

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Bill Sutton: on one side.

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Bill Sutton: like customizable in an arrow pointing to standardize and reflects the concept of right sizing. And Citrix makes it possible.

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Bill Sutton: I I will admit, not really fully understanding this. Do you guys, if one of you guys does, can you

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Bill Sutton: walk us through it?

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Geremy Meyers: Yeah. So I think what we're trying to land with this graphic bill, it's simply.

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Geremy Meyers: you know, unless you are a.

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Geremy Meyers: So I'm gonna I'm gonna make. I'm gonna put it just a made up number here right? Unless you're an organization that has maybe less than 500, you know, end users. There's a very good chance. You're gonna have a mix of what you're delivering

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Geremy Meyers: to your user population. Now, I'm not saying that anyone below 500 users is not seeing that I'm just telling you that as you start to get to the Enterprise level.

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Geremy Meyers: enterprise, size, organization, and I don't mean just fortune 500. But you know, more often than not. You're gonna have different user populations within your your user base. And they're gonna have different requirements. So, on the one hand, you've got office workers that you can give a very standardized desktop to right, and so that might represent a big portion of what you got for sure.

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Geremy Meyers: But then listen. You might have developers. You might have finance people. You might have different kinds of users that need something a bit more customizable, something where you need to open up their ability to maybe install applications or just have a different application. Set

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Geremy Meyers: next level, you might have a mix of on-prem and cloud based resource. So, for instance, you might have a super important critical application where the application infrastructure, not the citrix piece.

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Geremy Meyers: but like the actual back end, SQL. Databases and front ends and things like that actually might sit on prem, right? So you might be running sap on prem, right now, in the data center, we have a lot of customers doing that. So you have workloads that need to connect to that. And of course, Bill. What's the golden rule between.

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Geremy Meyers: you know, with Euc it's

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Geremy Meyers: keep the keep, the the desktop, keep the front end application close to the back end. Infrastructure. You're gonna have some performance issues

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Geremy Meyers: on the flip side. You might have some transactional seasonal workers where maybe it makes sense to spin up a desktop in a cloud, something where you don't want to buy on prem resources. You've got desktops that's in the cloud.

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Geremy Meyers: And so you might have a user population specifically for that. You might have customers who need a full users who need a full desktop, for instance, maybe their loan origination. You know, we've got a few of those right where they have 2 or 3 different apps open at the same time, and they need to copy and paste and do some things in between them, or it might be one single line of business app that you need to get out. So you might have a mix of that. And of course

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Geremy Meyers: not. Everyone's windows these days. Right? So I have customers who are 75% windows. But now they have a bucket of Mac users. And oh, by the way, they're doing some AI things with Linux, and they have some developers that might need a different OS as well. So you've got this mix of different user personas

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Geremy Meyers: that you have to account for. And as you get larger, you know, I'll say 500. Maybe it's 2 50, you know. I think that number varies, but a lot of it depends on your organizational requirements.

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Geremy Meyers: How do you pull that stuff together? And I think where this article lands is windows 3, 65 is probably just one component of that strategy. It might address one user group

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Geremy Meyers: unless you are 100% in azure

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Geremy Meyers: with a dedicated desktop for everyone. You know. You might not be using windows 3, 65 for everyone. You might have a mix, and I think that's where we're trying to land with. This is, it's probably a blended approach.

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Bill Sutton: Well, it's like power users and developers are gonna have one type of even in windows. 3, 65. They're gonna have one type of desktop.

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Geremy Meyers: Users.

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Bill Sutton: Might have a different type of desktop.

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Bill Sutton: But what this? What? This chart really in my mind to sip, just to really dumb it down, I guess, is the easiest way for me to do. It is in the past. We had a hammer and a nail. Now we've got this. This really built out toolbox with all these options? To fit the appropriate use case and you know, when this 365 is a great solution.

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Bill Sutton: but it's probably not the right solution for every. It isn't the right solution for every use case. But leveraging Citrix. We can address pretty much all of these use cases

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Bill Sutton: using the technology that Citrix provides, whether that's enabling connectivity to a win 365 desktop. And yes, you can do that through Citrix. I do it every day. That's what I'm doing right now. Is is, I'm running a windows 365 desktop via Citrix, and everything's accelerated with hdx and I I use it every day. I love it, it's performant it. It does the job for me. So that but that's not the that's not the case for everyone. Right, Todd.

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Todd Smith: Yeah, I think the critical thing here is as well is this is, you know, it's no longer a binary

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Todd Smith: question and answer. It's it's much more of a

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Todd Smith: you know, a dimmer switch right where you can say.

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Todd Smith: you know, 80% of my users

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Todd Smith: can run a standardized desktop that's running, you know, traditionally in the Cloud that's got a subset of published applications that are on a variety of different. OS's right. You've got a you know. You've got a

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Todd Smith: you can mix and match those requirements as needed without saying, well, I only deliver windows, desktops with the following core set of applications that you can't customize, and they're all going to be on prep. Right? Those days are over where you're where you're forcing customers

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Todd Smith: enforcing your users down a specific delivery model.

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Todd Smith: What we've also done. And and this is kind of where it gets very interesting is around the different types of solutions that can be delivered for this right? And I think this is where the the next graphic really kind of gets into.

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Bill Sutton: Yep.

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Todd Smith: Talking about, hey? We've got Linux. We've got Mac OS.

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Todd Smith: You can connect back to physical hardware with a remote PC. Option. You can do single session windows or multi session windows. And then also being able to say, okay for single session windows, do I want to have it be persistent

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Todd Smith: which basically is giving the person a full blown, you know. You

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Todd Smith: go back to your exact settings where you left off when you reboot the machine? Or do I want to have a non persistent desktop, which is the equivalent of getting a you know you shake the S sketch

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Todd Smith: to get your session reset, and then you start from you. Start your day with a clean desktop.

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Bill Sutton: Yeah, absolutely. And and that graphic that Todd was referring to is in the middle of the article, reflects the various elements of a machine of machine catalogs supporting these various use cases. So like a multi session windows machine or a single session, Mac, using the the Mac Connector or remote PC. Like, Todd said, and so forth, and and it doesn't call it out here. But you know persistent windows. Session could be a cloud. PC. In the same way.

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Bill Sutton: So the last section of the article gives a it shows a picture of the the citrix workspace, the workspace app page after you log in with all the icons on it. And reflects the fact that we can. We can leverage that workspace really to access any app or desktop that we need. That's published to us, based on our persona

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Bill Sutton: and again, like we've been talking about Cloud, PC. Is one of these, which is kind of how I work personally to these days. Any thoughts on this Jeremy.

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Geremy Meyers: Yeah. So

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Geremy Meyers: I mean the. So I'd like to talk about both of these. Actually. So the one interesting enough, I have not seen the admin console version of

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Geremy Meyers: this view. In a while I've talked a lot about the user side of this as well. So the one that looks like workspace. App is fantastic, because at the end of the day users don't care where any of the stuff sits right. They just want to click an icon.

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Bill Sutton: That's right.

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Geremy Meyers: App or desktop and just have it launch right? So you know what we've done here. We've kind of called it out. But

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Geremy Meyers: listen, we can have all of these resources, the desktops, the individual applications, the one thing that this article does not cover. But it's just something to be aware of is, listen! What if you're not doing any of that? And you're just publishing Sas applications? Right? You know, I can pull that up and launch that as well. So that's also

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Geremy Meyers: an option. If that's part of your strategy of, I'm not gonna give anyone any virtual thing, you know. We're just, gonna you know, sso them right into workday, for instance, right? But that user experience is important because it's it's abstracts everything. I'm just a user clicking an icon. Now it could be windows 365. So I think that's what we tried to point out here as well is

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Geremy Meyers: we can bubble that resource up, you click it. Off you go. You're actually using an hdx instead of an Rdp connection. Right? So we've improved the user experience. If you've got any policies we can lay that on as well. So this would be in addition to anything from a cloud. PC perspective. But if you're used to leveraging, you know certain Citrix policies to manage the on Prem desktop the, you know, cloud desktop.

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Geremy Meyers: You can layer those onto windows 3, 65 as well. But that's the user view via the admin view is man. It's just another just another machine catalog, different type. That's it

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Geremy Meyers: used to be all windows. Now, we've got remote, remote PC. In fact, we have some very large

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Geremy Meyers: remote PC deployments that feel like

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Geremy Meyers: our law. Firm friends have leveraged the heck out of remote PC.

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Geremy Meyers: But you know it's a mix of you know Mac OS and Linux as well these days. So both of those technologies are actually the Linux one for a long time. Actually, Mac OS is fairly fresh, actually. But I would say, argue, between the last year and a half or so 2 years, we've added Mac OS support. But

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Geremy Meyers: you know you're just managing it from a admin workflow from that same console you're managing everything else hasn't changed.

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Geremy Meyers: Some of your options are different, but that that's workload specific.

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Bill Sutton: Yep.

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Bill Sutton: alright. Any other thoughts on this we were at the end of the article. I do have a couple of other things I want to point out any other thoughts here. Todd or Jeremy.

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Geremy Meyers: I mean the punchline, and maybe I'm stealing your thunder. If this is point of view.

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Geremy Meyers: your thunders is oh, by the way, if you do want to integrate windows 365 in

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Geremy Meyers: regardless of what your license count is today.

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Geremy Meyers: We'll provide the ability to do an unlimited number of windows, 3, 65 connections. So you got

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Geremy Meyers: 11 billion licenses of that. Tie it right in. You know, we'll support you for 11 billion.

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Bill Sutton: How many is that, Jeremy?

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Geremy Meyers: It's a lot. It's a lot.

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Bill Sutton: It's a lot. Okay.

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Geremy Meyers: It's unlimited.

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Bill Sutton: Making sure, yeah, that that you? It's fine to steal my thunder. But yeah, I was, gonna say that what it's what it says here on at the end is the

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Bill Sutton: is the windows, 365 entitlement for current Citrix customers. And you can. You can have as many

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Bill Sutton: like, Jeremy said. As many windows, 365 Pcs. Cloud, Pcs. Delivered through Citrix as you want. In addition to all the other goodness you've got

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Bill Sutton: around different other types of applications. And again, these, the the end user view is driven largely by who you are and what groups you're in, so it can be. It can be as granular as as it needs to be. For the business.

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Bill Sutton: Todd. Any final thoughts.

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Todd Smith: Yeah, I I think the the big thing here is that.

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Todd Smith: you know, even if you're going down a windows 3, 65 journey. There are some benefits of continuing to leverage Citrix and some of the Citrix technologies to enhance and optimize that.

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Todd Smith: So if you look at the optimization pack that we have for windows 3, 65. It's included in your Citrix licenses like Jeremy said. You can use 11 billion licenses or instances of this off your off your citrix licenses. Work with your partners like Zintegra and your Citrix account team to really kind of figure out what is the best way to get access to all of these capabilities. And all these features.

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Todd Smith: windows 3, 65 by itself is a good experience.

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Todd Smith: Leveraging Citrix on top of it makes it a great experience.

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Bill Sutton: Yeah, I would agree with that for sure, Todd, like I said, I've been using it for about 2 months now, and

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Bill Sutton: short of a you know one or 2 hiccups that I think were

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Bill Sutton: maybe my own fault, or just the nature of the windows operating system, but but very minor and easily recoverable. I've had almost no problems. Teams, meetings.

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Bill Sutton: Zoom Meetings, work just fine. With HD hdx layer running inside of it. So it it's definitely something to consider.

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Bill Sutton: But like you said, most customers are gonna want a mix are gonna need a mix cause a lot of folks have sas applications these days, but they may. They may still have a requirement for a full desktop, and or or both. So there's lots of value in in leveraging Citrix for for the whole, the whole delivery mechanism for for your your use. Cases.

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Bill Sutton: final thought.

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Geremy Meyers: Yeah, we used to have a word for this bill. Do you remember what that word was? We used to be on all the it was flex cats. That's exactly what it was.

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Bill Sutton: Yeah, yes, it will.

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Bill Sutton: That's fantastic.

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Bill Sutton: All right, gentlemen. Anything else.

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Geremy Meyers: No, I think we're. I think this is. This is a good article. I love the series of blogs that we have in tech zone like a, you know, like we talked about earlier, they tend to be a little bit more technical focus. So we'll we'll sort of pick and choose.

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Bill Sutton: Yeah.

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Geremy Meyers: Across the board here, but what I do like about the blogs is they do probably the text on blogs in particular, and make it a little bit easier to sort of pick and choose the topic that you want to pick as well. So, for instance, you know, we we went down the path of app and desktop virtualization. So we see all the blogs that were

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Geremy Meyers: associated there. But there's Netscaler and Unicon, and some of our newer technologies as well.

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Geremy Meyers: But

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Geremy Meyers: don't be deceived. There are lots of resources in the community site, the tech zone site in general. So yeah, someone reach out about how to how to stand up some Uber agent last week, and as it turns out, we have a Poc guide for how to roll that out. So it's step by step, screenshots.

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Geremy Meyers: It's really good stuff. So make sure you check that out. Just community.citrix.com forward slash

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Geremy Meyers: tech zone dash blocks, but I think you'll get there just with.

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Todd Smith: We're also not.

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Bill Sutton: Dot com.

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Todd Smith: Talk.

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Bill Sutton: The route. So yeah.

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Todd Smith: We're talking about the tech zone, you know, there's the. It's not just the blogs.

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Todd Smith: There's a ton of resources out there. There's community discussion forums for both. The you know, the Citrix side as well as the Netscalar capabilities. And, more importantly, there's some resources up here. So if you really need to geek out and get some

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Todd Smith: visio stencils and architectural diagrams and architectural

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Todd Smith: capabilities where, you know, you need to include those in some type of either presentation or kind of just a you know, reference. Architecture.

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Todd Smith: tech zone is the place to go.

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Bill Sutton: Yup. Good to know. Great to know.

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Bill Sutton: All right, folks.

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Geremy Meyers: There's the Vdi handbook. Time have not seen that in a while. Looks like it's based on 24 0, 2. But

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Geremy Meyers: man, that is the that is the Bible. It follows a bit of the

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Geremy Meyers: the model of Citrix consulting as well. So it's some good stuff. There.

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Bill Sutton: Oh, yeah, I remember when that was a big Pdf.

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Geremy Meyers: A monster. Pdf is what it was. Yeah.

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Bill Sutton: Sure. So

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Bill Sutton: alright, gentlemen, thanks for your time today. And to our audience, we'll we'll see you on the next one.

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Geremy Meyers: Alright, thanks, Bill, thanks, Todd.

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Todd Smith: Thank you.